Results 1 to 6 of 6

Thread: Austrian Jaeger Musket

  1. #1
    Guest

    Austrian Jaeger Musket

    Does anybody know if any of those Austrian Jaeger rifles are approved by the NSSA? There's a .69 cal. version (I think Model 1849?), and I think a later .54 cal. version.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Kinston, N. C.
    Posts
    162
    the list is on the web page

  3. #3
    John Holland is offline Moderator
    Team:
    44th NY Volunteer Infantry
    Member
    00973V
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    1,573
    Region:
    Northeast- New York
    Ok, let's see if I can clear up the mis-conception about the "Approved Arms List"......one more time.

    The N-SSA's "Approved Arms List" is for REPRODUCTION ARMS only. Any reproduction arm on that list may be purchased and used in the N-SSA's Competitive Matches without having to be individually inspected by the Small Arms Committee.

    John Holland
    Chairman, Small Arms Committee

  4. #4
    John Holland is offline Moderator
    Team:
    44th NY Volunteer Infantry
    Member
    00973V
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    1,573
    Region:
    Northeast- New York

    Austrian Short Rifles

    Glenn,

    If I understand your question correctly, the two arms you have inquired about are both legal for use in the N-SSA. The 1849 Model is commmonly known as a "Garibaldi Rifle". It is actually .72 caliber, with 12 lands & grooves. They were originally Flint Lock ignition, with many of them being later converted to Tube Lock. The majority of them were finally converted to conventional percussion ignition with the addition of a patent breech assembly. At this time they were intended to be used with a .72 caliber round ball that was slammed down onto a shoulder above the powder chamber, thereby expanding the ball into the rifling. Shooting one today in the fashion it was intended can give accuracy results that are fair to moderate.

    The other Austrian Rifle you have asked about is the "Jagerstutzen". You can find some very good photographs of it in some of Tom Magno's posts on the "For Sale" page. There is a reproduction marketed by Dixie Gun Works that is on the "Approved Arms List". This arm is legal in either .54 or .58 caliber. If you use the one from DGW with the ram rod that is supplied individually, you must remove the wooden ball from the end of the ram rod for use in the N-SSA.

    I hope I have answered your questions.

    John Holland
    SAC

  5. #5
    Guest
    Hi John,
    Thank you for your reply. You did indeed answer my questions, and then some.
    I thought the .72 caliber version was used with a strange flat-based conical, but that must be another model. Your explanation about how seating the ball engages the rifling probably explains why the original ramrods on those have such a heavy head.
    -Glenn

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Springfield, Ohio, US
    Posts
    241

    Austrian M-1849 Garibaldi Rifle

    Glenn,

    Not to rain on John Holland's description of the Garibaldi, he does have it confused with the Austrian Model 1809 Jaeger which indeed started out as a flintlock, was converted to tube-lock, and then percussion and is similar to the Garibaldi. Glenn since the first Garibaldi was produced in 1849 they were made in tube-lock only and then to percussion. Garibaldi's going through Belgian had a new bolster welded onto the wrought iron barrel. Austrian arsenal conversions used a new patent breech, or the bolster conversion, but have a new lockplate made specifically for the conversion in many instances.

    The confusion on the Garibaldi's being flintlock started during the Civil War. :roll: The tube-lock lockplate has its screw, spring, and striker cover holes in the exact same positions as the screw, spring, and frizzen holes of a flintlock plate. Officers getting the Garibadi rifles thought there were getting old converted flintlocks. The truth was in many instances the Garibaldi rifles they were geting were only 6 or 7 years old. The reason for this is that in a tube-lock the percussion tube is inserted in the vent and the tube-lock percussion striker and cover, are in the same place as the the frizzen. The Liege gun makers converted thousand's of surplus Austrian tube-locks to flintlock lock for the African trade (the natives could not own percussion guns) by simply pulling the striker assembly, and substituting a frizzen & flint cock. When the guns were brought back into the US in the 1950's and 60's they were viewed as proof the tube-locks were originally flintlocks.

    Glenn The M-1849 is a simplified version of the earlier M-1842 Austrian Rifle, and were Delvigne system rifles. The changes made were deleting a barrel band and going to a key type retention system. Changing to fixtures and barrel bands from brass to steel.

    The Garibaldi's are typically 70-71 caliber with 0.01 deep rifling. The Garibaldi's being handmade and only partly interchangeable had an allow variation of 0.01" so they can be found from 69 caliber (tight bore) to 72 caliber (loose bore). Glenn this was not uncommon for the period bore to vary so much as the US Army allowed a variation of 0.01" on the M-1841 Mississippi rifle also during that period.


    Garibaldi Bullets L-R: 0.690 Lead RB, 680 grain Austrian compression bullet, 0.694 New Style Williams/Wilkinson bullet 560/630 grains.

    The Garibaldi used either a bare 0.690 soft lead round ball or a 600 some grain conical bullet. The bullets were rammed down to the patent breech which has a lip and several hard taps were given by the ramrod to the bullet expanding it into the rifling. Glenn this is why the tam rod has a hammer type head it literally beat the bullet into the rifling :shock: The Garibaldi M-1849 rifles modified for the conical bullet had a conical countersink in the ramrod head to minimize deformation as a Wilkinson type compression bullet was used.

    Glenn shooting the Garibaldi could be as easy as stuffing a 69 to 72 caliber round ball triple dipped down the bore, and giving it a couple of hard taps to seat it, and shoot if you have the old style ramrod. I've also had decent luck using Lyman 484 gr. 12 ga. slugs base lubed since the measure in at around 0.705". The 69 caliber New Style Williams/ Wilkinson bullets will also work, but require two seating taps to upset into the rifling like the original Austrian compression bullet. I hope the info helps.

    Best Regards:

    Greg Edington 8)

Similar Threads

  1. FS : Austrian jeager sold
    By Sam Sellaro, 12403 in forum Wanted/For Sale Items
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 05-11-2011, 03:03 PM
  2. Lorenz Jaeger for Sale
    By Jim Wimbish, 10395 in forum Wanted/For Sale Items
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 05-03-2011, 07:59 PM
  3. WTB Austrian Lorenz parts
    By Fauch125 in forum Wanted/For Sale Items
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 12-18-2010, 06:25 PM
  4. jaeger for sale best you will ever see
    By hp gregory, 9128 in forum Wanted/For Sale Items
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 05-16-2010, 01:56 PM
  5. Austrian Jaeger Rifle
    By in forum Civil War Small Arms
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 07-15-2009, 09:24 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •